ABS Delete for 95 Z26

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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Money pit Beretta » Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:03 pm

Cool Koots, are you getting rid of the ABS?


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Koots » Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:05 pm

I do want too, but I got to get it registered first. The current ABS system works fine, but I never was a big fan of traction control/ABS.

The traction control in my parents 09 Sierra Z71 (aluminum 5.3 V8) actually fights the natural urge to swing the tail sideways and has more than once caused me to bang the rear end off around on pavement as the brakes were applied but the truck was already swinging.

It caused enough kind of damage like that over my driving time with it, that one of the leaf springs is being replaced under warranty LOL

I've had numerous RWD vehicles and trucks and none have done that to me, because they let me use the pedal to steer the truck :D



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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Money pit Beretta » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:10 pm

Have you got a chance to work on the engine? Bet that has to come first.


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Koots » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:45 pm

Broke a headbolt off in the block, finally got it out, then ran out of time to work on it for a couple days.

Tonight I gotta call up my brother for some muscle to push it into the shop LOL

It will get a new HG, the head will be completely cleaned up and checked out.

Then it's a few parts away from street legal. Hopefully the LTZ grille panel I bought gets in soon too, so I can clean/paint it and keep it from looking like a base.



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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Money pit Beretta » Mon Jul 02, 2012 6:00 pm

Dang that had to be tough to get out. Hope you get it up and running soon! Crap I should have just PM'ed you.


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Slinky » Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:38 pm

Anyone ever figure out what master cylinder ect could be used for a 95'?

I deleated my abs and would like to get rid of the bulky abs master cylinder and put on a smaller non abs one, i just need to know from what vehicle ect the parts need to be from..


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby scd88ga » Mon Aug 13, 2012 12:19 pm

Slinky wrote:Anyone ever figure out what master cylinder ect could be used for a 95'?

I deleated my abs and would like to get rid of the bulky abs master cylinder and put on a smaller non abs one, i just need to know from what vehicle ect the parts need to be from..


Get one for a pre-abs Beretta. Then get the brake line adapter fittings, bleed brakes, DONE!


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Slinky » Tue Aug 14, 2012 5:25 am

would i have to match up the size of the bore with my current one?


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Koots » Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:34 am

Slinky wrote:would i have to match up the size of the bore with my current one?


I think they all just fit in, all the same size, as far as I know.

Just get one for a Beretta/Corsica :D.



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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby 3X00-Modified » Tue Aug 14, 2012 9:02 am

Everyone is going to disagree on this, just like how they disagree that the master in our cars can't support a disc/disc setup without issues.

Your best bet is to just try one and see how the pedal feels... That's all you can do. After that if you wish to calculate your old bore vs new bore to see if you changed your bias any you can, but I think the only thing you'll feel is the pedal going down further if the front pistons are any larger than the old style, and thats only if the bore is actually different as well.

Bottom line is your not going to have any issues, your pedal will just possibly feel different.



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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby 88_GTU » Tue Aug 14, 2012 12:00 pm

The pre-ABS MC fits fine. We put one in a 92GTZ and in a buddies 94 Cavy Z24 with no issues.


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Slinky » Tue Aug 14, 2012 12:14 pm

ok, because i saw one with a 7/8" piston and one with a 1"


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Money pit Beretta » Tue Aug 14, 2012 12:52 pm

With the larger one you will need the porportioning valve made for that one. If you can get that I'd go for the 1 inch. From what I read on Rock Auto the GA MS has a 1 inch bore.


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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby 3X00-Modified » Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:39 pm

Please read up on changing the bore size before recommending it.
The most critical factor in master cylinder selection is bore size. Bore sizes can range from 5/8 inches upward to 1 1/8 inches or more. The bore size determines the amount of hydraulic pressure and fluid volume that will be sent downstream to the calipers. The actual amount of hydraulic pressure generated is based on the amount of force coming from the pedal or booster being divided by the area in square inches of the master cylinder bore. For example, a master cylinder with a 1-inch bore has .785 square inches or bore area. ( Bore x Bore x .785) If the pedal or booster delivers 500 pounds of force to the master cylinder, the hydraulic pressure will be equal to 500 divided by .785, which would result in 637 psi going to the lines. The displaced volume capacity is then based on the length of the available stroke multiplied by the bore area. It's the same formula that's used to calculate engine displacement for one cylinder.

Generally speaking, if the master cylinder bore is too large, the driver will feel a very hard pedal feel with minimal pedal travel, and will have a difficult time generating the necessary pressure to effectively operate the brake system. If the master cylinder bore size is too small, the driver will be able to generate a lot of pressure, but the pedal may have an excessively long stroke or a very spongy feel. And if the bore size is way too small, the pedal or master cylinder may bottom out before enough volume is pumped to operate the calipers. The best advice would be to consult with the manufacturer of the brake system you will be using and work with them to pick the right size for your application.


Stock 95 and 96 Beretta is 7/8" piston. Not sure where you saw 1" as an option since 89 and 92 are also 7/8"

I had to learn all this stuff when working on the modified to figure out what we should be doing for natural brake bias with what calipers we have and pistons sizes and piston amounts and so on and so forth... I was blown away when I figured out how all of it works and how larger masters actually equals less pressure with more flow and such.

I will be looking into the stock 96 master soon for my car since I now have 2 spares and I'm going to try and figure out how the combination valve in that is operated so I can eliminate it and revert to a proportioning valve and gain better control over by true brake bias. I've never had issues with my rear disc but yes I agree that they may not be doing as much as they could be since I'm betting there is a combination valve in there limiting the pressure to the rear since there are typically drums back there.

More info

http://www.mpbrakes.com/uploads/documents/optomize.pdf



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Re: ABS Delete for 95 Z26

Postby Money pit Beretta » Tue Aug 14, 2012 2:22 pm

Great info there, that was much needed. Is this the first time you posted this? Sure seems like there should be a topic with a sticky(lol, yes another sticky).

Damn you have two extras, I have a brand new MS sitting in a box right now for the 95. I want to go up to the 1inch as I don't see that as too much(1 vs 7/8). Going from 5/8 to 1 inch now seems like too much. Thanks to your info.
I read long ago about some line pressure booster that they made for the old 55-57 Chevys. They were hitting some massive psi with those things. Guess I'd should get a better understanding of how things work. I was thinking only of psi and not the pedal.


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