REPLACING SPEAKERS

For all those little gadgets that make driving your car more fun and convienent. Big subs, screaming tweets? Got an amp that's on the way out? Need some recommendations? Then this is the place to ask.
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timgerman
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REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby timgerman » Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:59 pm

Quick question, when replacing the speakers from stock -

1. do you need to get a specific ohm and wattage speakers?

2. do you need to have an amp?


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby DTMAce » Thu Mar 07, 2013 5:51 pm

8-10 ohm is fine with a stock head unit. Wattage between (RMS)50-100, but I wouldn't go higher than 200-300W peak, unless running aftermarket HU.
If so, then go with what they recommend.

Amps, only if you are going to use line out feeds on an aftermarket HU and want to beef it. then get speakers rated to meet or slightly above the amp.


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Thompson128 » Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:59 pm

Stock can run 4 ohm


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby timgerman » Fri Mar 08, 2013 9:06 am

i have an aftermarket head unit and was thinking about getting bose 6x9 for the back. havent thought about the front speakers yet.


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby 3X00-Modified » Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:38 am

Whats the power output from the HU? Mine is supposed to be high but I still have all 4 speakers amp'd with a 4 channel 400watt amp.

Just remember in doing the rear speakers you need to remove the back seat to get the deck lid cover off since they drop in from the top, and you may also need to remove the rear quarter window plastic since that also overlaps the rear decklid. Bottom line, rear speaker removal is a pain in the ass, and I suggest reversing how they are mounted when you put the new ones in so you can just remove them from the trunk next time if necessary.



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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Money pit Beretta » Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:13 pm

Damn right 3X00. It is a pain and it's a great idea to mount the speakers under.
Tim be careful with plastic trim panels back there, they are old and the mounts break easy. Oh and stay away from Dorman trim panel holders. They are junk and snap easy, I broke a few just putting them in. I even have a topic on it "Dorman sucks".


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Berettas#1 » Sun Mar 10, 2013 4:25 am

I have never had to take the back seats out to replace the rear 6x9s. I have done it on 3 91+ berettas it takes a little bit of work to wiggle them out but its better then going through all that steps you guys did. On my current car, I just cut out holes in the board and I think it looks really good that way too.

No you do not need an amp for your normal speakers unless you wanted one of course. I have a alpine deck and there is a inline amp that just runs from the stock wires which I think is cool. I would not worry to much about ohms/wattage for a regular speaker set up though.


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Koots » Sun Mar 10, 2013 4:55 am

I just ended up pulling everything off when I took my rear interior out, but I have a bad history of breaking everything off when taking interiors out, so I had to be extra careful.



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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby 3X00-Modified » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:08 am

Berettas#1 wrote:I have never had to take the back seats out to replace the rear 6x9s. I have done it on 3 91+ berettas it takes a little bit of work to wiggle them out but its better then going through all that steps you guys did. On my current car, I just cut out holes in the board and I think it looks really good that way too.

No you do not need an amp for your normal speakers unless you wanted one of course. I have a alpine deck and there is a inline amp that just runs from the stock wires which I think is cool. I would not worry to much about ohms/wattage for a regular speaker set up though.


Doesn't apply since you didn't remove the cardboard... Not everyone wants to cut the cardboard out and display the fancy speakers.

And ohm's wattage does matter quite a bit...



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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Berettas#1 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:41 pm

Sorry I should have said, I have removed and replaced the speakers under the cardboard peice without cutting or removing anything other then the speakers 3 times its not difficult. I have only made holes once, on my current car.

And for most normal setup's ohms and wattage are not a big deal from what I have learned. Each speaker on most decks is going to get 50 watts if you have 4 speakers at 2 ohms each which is a good amount of what is sold at normal stores. Its pretty simple if you just want a better sounding setup but not a competition system by any means, thats what I think anyways.


1995 Z26 auto 3100 spfi (sold)
1989 GT 5 speed 2.8 mpfi (crushed)
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1988 GTU 5 speed 3500
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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby DTMAce » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:02 pm

Ohm's don't matter. Interesting.

Lower ohm (resistance) means the speaker draws more current. More current/amps, which translates into wattage required. Some radios will not work well, or for long at those loads at higher volumes, leading to distortion (both perceived and non perceived) and/or amplifier burnout/damage. Now if the output of the radio SAYS it can handle 2-10 ohms, then sure. If it says 8 or 8-10 (which most of the ones I have worked with have) then that is what you should be using.

Wattage matters too. Lets say you have a 25 watt RMS per channel stereo. You can connect 25W-50W RMS speakers to that setup and have a good volume range. Now. The higher the speaker wattage, the higher the peaks and volume can be turned up without distortion. HOWEVER. You go with too high a wattage speaker (lets say 200W or more) and you will actually start to get less volume out of the speaker. Why? Because those higher wattage speakers require more power to move than a lower one. So to say you can just willy nilly hook up whatever to whatever is not entirely truthful. You have to have some understanding of limits if you want good sound. Problem is many of us have a tin ear and don't know what good sound sounds like. LOL No offense to anyone, but it happens.

External amps on the other hand have a wider range of ohm support and power. I have seen some that can run 1 ohm ranges. While they don't make speakers too often at that range, you can use 2 - 2ohm speakers in parallel to get 1 ohm, as an example. Hooking up speakers in series adds the ohms together, and hooking them in parallel gives you USUALLY half of the ohm rating of both speakers (2 8ohm gives you 4ohm for example) I said usually because there are different rules when doing parallel setups.

Sorry, but I prefer that at least some good info be understood with this. It helps to make better sound. I won't even get into dynamics, speaker placements, etc. That is another big ball of worms.


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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Berettas#1 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:44 am

I really do understand how it all works, but I think your still missing my point. Almost everything you can goto a store and buy will be very simple for a regular setup. I was not trying to say they dont matter at all but I dont see a reason to overcomplicate something when it does not need to be that difficult. Thats just my opinion, from what I have learned and done myself sorry if you feel thats the wrong thing to share.


1995 Z26 auto 3100 spfi (sold)
1989 GT 5 speed 2.8 mpfi (crushed)
1993 GT 5 speed 3.1 mpfi (dd)
1988 GTU 5 speed 3500
1996 Base/Z26 hybrid 3400-3500 turbo 5 speed


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smgreen20
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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby smgreen20 » Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:05 pm

There's nothing wrong with sharing, but it is the little things that count. From what I can see concerning the whole wattage/speaker/amps deal with ohms law, no one is fully right, nor are they fully wrong. In order of posts, I will try to correct what I see wrong.


"8-10 ohm is fine with a stock head unit. Wattage between (RMS)50-100, but I wouldn't go higher than 200-300W peak, unless running aftermarket HU."

8-10 ohm speakers is what's factory used, but the factory HU can run 4 ohm speakers w/o any issues.

"Amps, only if you are going to use line out feeds on an aftermarket HU and want to beef it. then get speakers rated to meet or slightly above the amp."

A guide for the "idiot", yes. Match the speakers rms to the amps rated rms. It's more practical to have an amp that outputs more wattage then what the speaker can handle. As the amp reaches it's limit on the wattage it can produce, it starts to "clip" the signal. That is the number one killer of a speaker (distortion, which is usually caused by the user trying to get more out of an amp then what it can produce). If an amp that does 100 wrms and you have a 150 wrms speaker, the speaker is considered to be under powered and the common user tries to squeeze more from the amp then what it can CLEANLY do.

"Whats the power output from the HU? Mine is supposed to be high but I still have all 4 speakers amp'd with a 4 channel 400watt amp."
GM Factory for these cars, ~7-8w/pc. After market HUs, it depends. Typically 17-22w/pc even if it states 50w x4 chs.

"I would not worry to much about ohms/wattage for a regular speaker set up though."

As I saw stated, it's a big deal. That 8 ohm speaker will get half the wattage that the 4 ohm speaker will. That's a difference of 3dB, a very noticeable difference in volume. Speaker sensitivity also plays a role. A 8 ohms speaker getting 50w w/a sens. of 91dB 1w/1m, is just as loud as a 4 ohm speaker getting 25w w/a sens of 94dB 1w/1m. There's a lot to take in and consider.

"And for most normal setup's ohms and wattage are not a big deal from what I have learned. Each speaker on most decks is going to get 50 watts if you have 4 speakers at 2 ohms each which is a good amount of what is sold at normal stores."

It can be a big deal for the reason/s I stated above.
99% of the speakers sold at normal stores are 4 ohm, not 2. For speakers, not subs, 2 ohms are a rarity. They are easily found, but not common.


"Lower ohm (resistance) means the speaker draws more current. More current/amps, which translates into wattage required"

I'm nit picking here, but to clarify and put in the correct order, Lower ohm (resistance) means the speaker draws more POWER or WATTAGE from the amp. More current/amps, it what the amp will pull from the cars electrical system. Now, the signal from the amp is in AC, so current/amps are present, but not harmful until you're reaching the 1000w+ area.

"Wattage matters too. Lets say you have a 25 watt RMS per channel stereo. You can connect 25W-50W RMS speakers to that setup and have a good volume range. Now. The higher the speaker wattage, the higher the peaks and volume can be turned up without distortion. HOWEVER. You go with too high a wattage speaker (lets say 200W or more) and you will actually start to get less volume out of the speaker. Why? Because those higher wattage speakers require more power to move than a lower one. So to say you can just willy nilly hook up whatever to whatever is not entirely truthful. You have to have some understanding of limits if you want good sound."

This relates to what I said in my reply about amp power rms vs the speakers rms and distortion along with the speakers sensitivity. "... (lets say 200W or more) and you will actually start to get less volume out of the speaker. Why? Because those higher wattage speakers require more power to move than a lower one" This is considered to be a false statement. The speakers wrms "limit" has nothing to do with that. It's because of the speakers thermal and mechanical capabilities.

"...and hooking them in parallel gives you USUALLY half of the ohm rating of both speakers (2 8ohm gives you 4ohm for example) I said usually because there are different rules when doing parallel setups."

Here's the formula: R1 x R2/(R1 + R2)




I hope to not offend anyone, just clearing things up. I've been doing this for almost 20yrs as a hobby and for extra $$. I enjoy it and take it seriously. You can google my username and you'll find I'm very active at a lot of car audio forums. Mainly DIYmobilecaraudio.com and PhoenixPhorum.com
Last edited by smgreen20 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Berettas#1
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Re: REPLACING SPEAKERS

Postby Berettas#1 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:14 am

No offense taken on my part, I do understand how audio systems work at there full potential. I just dont think most care enough to learn what all goes into it. They just want sound, and that just is my opinion.


1995 Z26 auto 3100 spfi (sold)
1989 GT 5 speed 2.8 mpfi (crushed)
1993 GT 5 speed 3.1 mpfi (dd)
1988 GTU 5 speed 3500
1996 Base/Z26 hybrid 3400-3500 turbo 5 speed


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