The truth once and for all

[Guest]

Merry Christmas Everyone!

FYI I did buy a PPI Amp from Jaimie way back in 1999 was Mint and great price! I even think he took a hit since the shipping to Canada was Crazy!

Ok back to lurk mode!

Take a day off Folks and go be with your families!

[rweatherford]

Yea Santa is tired from being up late last night.  Kids should be up soon.  I think I'll lock this thing up this morning so everyone can just go celebrate.  I'll open it up on Monday morning.  

[rweatherford]

Closed



Will open Monday Dec 27th for more of the same.

[rweatherford]

Unlocked as promised.

[Guest]

Quote (Jdawg4201 @ Dec. 24 2004,17:26)756.20 are for all those parts  rediculious where did you get these parts? guam??
400 for Labor? ###?
you guys have issues


J ever need help on your call you know exactally how to contact me bro nj aint far we both know this
I see nothing at all wrong with charging for parts/labor to other Bnet members.  You may not care about making a living, but most of us do - and if I'm asked to take 12-14hrs out of my weekend to do work for someone, then I expect to be compensated.

Don't get me wrong, I've always been one to lend a helping hand when needed, but there is a HUGE difference between "helping" someone work on a car, and doing it for them.  Ribz didn't ask Steph and Erich to come down and help him with the swap, he asked them to come down and DO it for him.  The prices Erich quoted Ribz on the parts may be a bit higher then you could aquire them for at a junkyard, but they are WELL below retail.  Also, don't forget that Erich and Steph spent time collecting and pulling those parts, AND that the price was quoted and agreed to before any work was done.

I don't know about you, but when I contact a company to do work for me, I don't expect parts for cost and free labor.

[Ribz80]

I actually think 400 for all the intended labor was beyond reasonable, bordering on cheap. ÂÂÂ Also their prices were more then fair overall. ÂÂÂ I had issues with only a couple of items which have been addressed over and over again. PLus in those instances it wasnt about being over priced for the item, like 250 for a tranny, it was how the prices came to be,  but once again you have already read about it.

[ErichZ26]

That first AIM message between Jamie and myself/stephanie was when we were at hotel in Kalamazoo.  Thats when the argument on money started and it appears that Geoff was very into Jamie's mindset.  My question is why didn't Geoff help you out on this or work out something to get the parts with you prior?  Is Geoff still your friend?  He's sitting here evidently supporting Jamie in these AIM's but when we talk to him he complains how Jamie "dances" around the car while Geoff works.   These AIM conversations and the nickle and diming us hours before the swap was to occur, the situation at the "jobsite" led to exact prices.  You want to sit here and argue over the $250 trans.  My intentions were to recoup my time spent.  I did not appreciate the problems you gave me the night before while i was in Kalamazoo.  You did not even remove parts from the interior as you promised(forgot about this until you posted the AIM convo)

[Ribz80]

Quote (ErichZ26 @ Dec. 27 2004,12:00)That first AIM message between Jamie and myself/stephanie was when we were at hotel in Kalamazoo.  Thats when the argument on money started and it appears that Geoff was very into Jamie's mindset.  My question is why didn't Geoff help you out on this or work out something to get the parts with you prior?  Is Geoff still your friend?  He's sitting here evidently supporting Jamie in these AIM's but when we talk to him he complains how Jamie "dances" around the car while Geoff works.   These AIM conversations and the nickle and diming us hours before the swap was to occur, the situation at the "jobsite" led to exact prices.  You want to sit here and argue over the $250 trans.  My intentions were to recoup my time spent.  I did not appreciate the problems you gave me the night before while i was in Kalamazoo.  You did not even remove parts from the interior as you promised(forgot about this until you posted the AIM convo)
See here is why my time will no longer be wasted on you.   You spew misinformation.   I then spent page after page correcting it one by one.   Then you skip over 99% of it.   People arent going to read this thing, they are going to get peices.   But you get to read every word as do I.  

So back to all your misinfo...

I included all AIMs and even put them in chronoligical order already.  The arguement for money didnt start there.  I asked how much was paid to Steph while at the hotel and she "didnt know" at first even though I had already heard from geoff.  The convo is there in the open for everyone else to see.  

Why didnt Geoff help me out?   Geoff and I were in the same boat.  Both of us were trying to graduate and do our final projects and working, i was with VW at the time still.   He was always well aware of the progress and plenty of updates.   When your tranny couldnt be used guess who helped me and YOU out....Geoff.   Geoff knew of that trans quite a few days before your arrival, a full week+ perhaps.  Without Geoff coming through in Kzoo on the tranny mounts again, we wouldnt be here, you never would have came in March and things could have turned out different.  

Geoff and I are still freinds and have stayed in contact even after I moved out of Michigan.  he has insane hours since joining the real world with a real job, so we talk less often.

Yes he did support me in IMs.  He took the ball on this project not so much because he wanted to, but he saw I was left hanging.  He was busy and logged a lot more miles then you did.   He saw this first hand once he started working on the car about all the things you did or didnt do.  

Yes I know Geoff talks about my "dancing", its rather funny.   I amitt to it.   I was traumitized years ago by working on my car and I also hate not knowing how to do something.   Our first project my suspension in August 03', I danced and passed tools.   I danced because I was nervous, rightfully so since nothing goes right and even that project had its backups.   But at the end I knew the entire suspension from watching him.   Now I know my front brakes an drefuse to pay someone and no the whole front end and will only pay to do alignments.   By Geoff taking over the tranny, my dancing went to over load.   Things kept on getting worse.  he would find more things you guys didnt get right or a part I would need all over again.   At the same time I would be in CLASS, having to run out every half and hour or so to check that maybe things were better.   A lot of people would be nervous and "dance" around the car if they were too.

The situation on the job site led to exact prices...your words.   That sounds like BS, we needed the same parts for a 5spd swap on the job site or in Mongolia.   You were looking to get a financial punishment from me after being annoyed by the garage situation.  

"You want to sit here and argue over the $250 trans.  My intentions were to recoup my time spent."

Dont you get with that line you have proved my point.  You intended to use the trans to recoup something.  I had the money, money was not the issue.   You didnt list MISC fee of XXXX for this or that, you just stuck it in with the tranny and I SPOTTED it and questioned it.  It wasnt a deal breaker to me.   You were spose to come back and finish, you would have gotten money.   Having to go through Geoff and Chazz wound up costing me quite a bit more.  I dont regret it because frankly I am confident the car came out better because of it.   So your rendition of Jamie got cheap and wouldnt pay and fired us just doesnt work.

"I did not appreciate the problems you gave me the night before while i was in Kalamazoo."

Once again with that line you prove my point some more.   I never even talked to YOU, I talked to steph.  No problem was had.   I inquired about the tranny and at first she didnt know how much it was.   The convo is there, not an ill word was said.  If you had a problem you could have voiced it, you are big boy.   Things could have blown up then instead of you coming to Detroit in the first place, I saw no issues yet.   BUT ou indicate having a problem at the hotel room already.

"You did not even remove parts from the interior as you promised(forgot about this until you posted the AIM convo)"

Another example of you not reading.  I said I would strip the interior.   First convo steph mentions the column, I admitt not knowing it and said it.   I took out everything else, seats, trim etc.   Next time we spoke I explained the stuff was out but the shift lever was stuck as if it was in a neutral, lts there in the IM.

[Ribz80]

Quote (spacecadetz26 @ Dec. 25 2004,00:24)I never once asked you to pay for my hotel room or gas. Never once... Where is the im about saving all the conversations so there are no suprises? I was not planning on "surprising" you with extra costs thats why.

I never once told you that I would charge you cost on the transmission so i dont understand why paying $250 is ripping you off.
Still the trans costs $135 and you only wanted to pay $65 because thats what Geoff said.   You never AGAIN told me to bring usuable axles, but cores because you were to buy *NEW* ones at autozone in Detroit along with your fidanza flywheel. I got axles but from a 5spd 2.4 isuzu grand am for cores. since new ones are $60 a piece when you have cores to help you get the best parts for the money. You wanted brand new wheel bearings, brand new axles, and a new flywheel. I brought all cores "assuming" autozone carried them in stock like they do in Chicago. But #### hit the fan when autozone didnt have anything we needed.
A smart person would think that if the flywheel was not machined, it could have been because it was meant for a core... even though it was in really good shape for a used flywheel.

I openly admitted forgetting the jacks, $30 for a set of jack stands isnt alot of money. borrowing them from a friend is priceless though.

RIBZ80: XX we'll make a run to the detroit auotzone and see what we can get XX
edethloff: ok
RIBZ80:  XXX  flywheel axles and bearings XXX
edethloff:  XXXXX we got all that XXXXX
RIBZ80: XXX yeah, mainly as back ups or cores XXX
edethloff: XXXX but i'd get the flywheel XXX


What parts did Geoff get? I'm trying to recall but I believe Geoff was supposed to "scab" the mounts.

RIBZ80: Geoff can scab parts too
RIBZ80: on the phone with him now
StephMartinZ26: i see

That last convo from Erich is missing a prior conversation.

Remember, I offered to do a brake upgrade, and rebuilt struts, install a transmisson with engine mounts, and install clutch/brake pedals for $400? is that really highway robbery? too much to ask? I drove 330 miles, got a room, paid for and removed a greasly 200k mile transmission, CLEANED IT,  worked in a school parking garage with a security guard harassment service 20 ft away and cars driving by every 10 minutes. No power outlets, basically no lighting, no water.. Gimme a break.

Shifter plate - $20
Shifter assembly not just arm - $15
penny items. gimme a break.

Once I realized that you were trying to wheel and deal me on the transmission, I decided to take it upon myself that I didnt want to do business with you anymore, since what i paid for the hotel and gas wouldnt have been included since it was never discussed, remember no surprises.. I was royally pissed.

You can see Erichs total as $892, and your total of $850... $42 difference.  You never once offered to buy us lunch while we were working, which we did for 14 hours straight. or even be the least thankful for what we were doing for you. You just kept saying how you could give us/me things, honestly you didnt have anything I wanted. I just wanted the experience and to walk away fair and square.  I never called you inept. I never called you names. Grow up.
I have tried to listen to your arguements.  Just when I start to resent you guys less and want to take on more blame Cack comes with either a lie or blatant misinformation.  Then my feelings go out the window and I feel no sympathy for you all over again.  So lets get to whats not right in this reply:

You are correct you never asked me for hotel or gas, nor did I claim so.  And no you did not surprise me with extra costs.  Cack already said the tranny at 250 was a way of getting his time back, thats the issue I discussed.

OK back to this transmission.  From early on you HAD one yourself.  It was said to have something like 70k, this is a good score.  The tranny I wound up with was much in part due to Geoff who helped both parties out.  It also had nearly 200k.  Maybe an analogy would help

I buy a car on ebay described as mint for $5k.  Before going to pick it up someone hits the car door.  I show up to pick it up and the guy explains what happened, he put ANOTHER car door on the car in the wrong color, but hey it works.

A- Do I hand the guy the same $5k
B- Its no longer what we had originally agreed upon for 5k

So I tell the guy its not what we agreed and I give him 4500.

You assumed that the 200k tranny was worth the same to me compared to the 70k tranny you had.   I put inthe convo with you and goeff discussing the tranny.  he gave an analogy too and once again you are like HUH?  Basically this discussion will continue to just spin round and round because concepts like this you just dont seem to accept. ÂÂÂ

"You never AGAIN told me to bring usuable axles, but cores because you were to buy *NEW* ones at autozone in Detroit along with your fidanza flywheel. I got axles but from a 5spd 2.4 isuzu grand am for cores. since new ones are $60 a piece when you have cores to help you get the best parts for the money. You wanted brand new wheel bearings, brand new axles, and a new flywheel. I brought all cores "assuming" autozone carried them in stock like they do in Chicago. But #### hit the fan when autozone didnt have anything we needed."

Again we went over this.  WE had time to get parts.  I tried at first to get new, it was a preference and I had the money.  Axles with cores were cheap.  I did NOT need your axles as cores, you knew that.  I was to give them MY auto axles as cores since we knew they wouldnt no any better.  So your he wanted them as cores does not work.  I used the term back up for axles, flywheel for a core.  The aluminum flywheel was discussed the first conversation.  Within 24 hours of talking to geoff and looking around that it was no longer on ebay for $200 you were notified.  So that Fidanza was old news and weeks ago in terms of information in regards to the flywheel needing to be purchased.  I made sure of backups with you and you agreed.  Why would you have come if you didnt think everything was accounted for?  You did think that everything was accounted for because anything that I was not able to get you knew already.   I think you had timing issues and or forgot things that you had planned on taking.  So you thought you would buy everything in deroit afterall because as you said you can them at Chicago autozones.  We went all over detroit and came up empty handed, i think you were surprised by this since again, chicago would have had it.  But still we had the wrong strut,used hydraulics(neither parties fault), and you didnt even know about the wrong mount yet.  How long would it have bene till you learned of the mount.  That would have kept you guys in Detroit longer and we would have needed more axles which took a couple days to order each. Even If I had gotten all the parts myself we still wouldnt have been sucessful.

So lets suppose we had every part brand spanking new.   Moral of the story is we would still be here.   The other issues still went down keeping us from doing the car.   You still would have left it the way it was, though with axles in, and I still would have had issue with the tranny being priced in thre manner it was and we would wind up here.   So in summation your parts arguement doesnt change the outcome.  

Again I think your quote of 400 was for a lot of work and was very fair, tell me where thats been questioned by me.

Yes the shifter plate and arms are penny items, they werent listed for money.  They were listed as an example of what upset me.  I was picked on by you to that I didnt get things I promised, all along you knew of the right shift arm and you got the wrong one.  I saw it right then but didnt whine, afterall i wanted the car to run, not be pretty as you have accused me of.

"once I realized that you were trying to wheel and deal me on the transmission, I decided to take it upon myself that I didnt want to do business with you anymore,"

That says a lot right there.  I thought i was the one getting the train run on them over the tranny.  Thats the key here so I hope you read this...you see it one way and I another.  The other key is what you said is a big admission.  Cack was talking to me talking about things he was taking back and or not doing but still insinuating finishing  But at the same time you had already decided to leave me hanging.  I never fired you, I never said you wouldnt get paid, I had another 800 in cash left besides the 4-500 balance.  I brought up the tranny you got furious because you thought I had nerve to nickel and dime you when you slaved and got nothing for room and gas, thats you in a nutshell.  But ididnt bring it up for the money, I brought it up because I was feeling unsure of your motives and honesty.  You lost it, admitt it, you then refused to finish and left me hanging.  Its that simple.  At that point you werent going to get anything more from me then 425.  You got 425 for parts.  that included brake pads, a shift cable, that I had to buy all over again.  I was torn about giving you some more money, maybe 200 for partial labor.  It was insisted that I do no such thing, you were trying to leave me hanging. ÂÂÂ

You never called me names?  Thats a lie, I have heard and seen all your references to being a jew etc etc, I have heard it for atleast a year already.  Dont try and be a saint.  I flat out admitt to having plenty of names for you and cack.

I never tried to buy you lunch?  I know you had Burger King but you know what, you may very well be right, my manners slipped and I might now have offered to pay.  But I am unsure of that, I keep searching my memory.  I know I bought you guys coffee and paid for that because at a certain point you were out of cash, but I do feel bad it didnt occur to me to pay for lunch.

i was thankful.  I was excited like a little girl with every conversation we had online and as each day drew closer.  My excitement shranK each passing hour of the swap as things got worse and worse and perhaps I begain to panic as I had finals in the morning.  It didnt occur to me to thank you once my car was kinda butchered, but I apologize for that if I had not gotten screwed.

[Ribz80]

At a certain point this is going to be a wash.  You see things a very different way then me and i dont think thats going to change any anything I say.  But there are no more secrets here, look it at over 1000 views and I will sleep better not holding this experience in.  But I am flying out with my girl for our holiday and new years trip.  That is going to be my focus.  I will reply when I can.  I hope to only reply to good points and arguements not going around the same points that just dont seem to sink in.  I think I have a novel in typing to replies in this one and I dont regret my time spent.  A couple of times you opened my eyes(steph only) and I did see myself being a pretty poopie host at times.  Cack is still in la la la land where he gets things wrong mainly because 9 out of 10 times there was a talk it wasnt with him.  Yet everytime I waste my type to correct him he kinda skips along and goes back to some other mute point or talks trash about my cars, or something else.  So if I were to apologize for anything or to anyone, it will be for being not so considerate a host to Steph.  So if I dont reply to anything for awhile it means I am packing and living up my vacation.

[ErichZ26]

All i can say is poor Jamie.  You want to sit and complain about me when you were part of the problem.

[HeartBeatKid]

Quote (Ribz80 @ Dec. 27 2004,17:13) Cack is still in la la la land where he gets things wrong mainly because 9 out of 10 times there was a talk it wasnt with him. ÂÂÂ


Yet everytime I waste my type to correct him he kinda skips along and goes back to some other mute point or talks trash about my cars, or something else.  So if I were to apologize for anything or to anyone, it will be for being not so considerate a host to Steph. ÂÂÂ




So if I dont reply to anything for awhile it means I am packing and living up my vacation.
my words exactally


thats so fugin true



HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR BRO!
talk to you in 05 and have a safe trip


i also wana add i think this as far as its gonna go im seeing things get repeted over and over and over again J there not worth it anymore  belive me    COURT IS AJOURNED !

[ErichZ26]

Quote (Jdawg4201 @ Dec. 27 2004,22:33)Quote (Ribz80 @ Dec. 27 2004,17:13) Cack is still in la la la land where he gets things wrong mainly because 9 out of 10 times there was a talk it wasnt with him. ÂÂÂ


Yet everytime I waste my type to correct him he kinda skips along and goes back to some other mute point or talks trash about my cars, or something else.  So if I were to apologize for anything or to anyone, it will be for being not so considerate a host to Steph. ÂÂÂ




So if I dont reply to anything for awhile it means I am packing and living up my vacation.
my words exactally


thats so fugin true



HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR BRO!
talk to you in 05 and have a safe trip


i also wana add i think this as far as its gonna go im seeing things get repeted over and over and over again J there not worth it anymore  belive me   COURT IS AJOURNED !
And you were helping Jamie's case?


Maybe you should be his "mekanic" and use your ASE testing so we don't have these problems.

[HeartBeatKid]

Quote (ErichZ26 @ Dec. 27 2004,23:45)Quote (Jdawg4201 @ Dec. 27 2004,22:33)Quote (Ribz80 @ Dec. 27 2004,17:13) Cack is still in la la la land where he gets things wrong mainly because 9 out of 10 times there was a talk it wasnt with him. ÂÂÂ


Yet everytime I waste my type to correct him he kinda skips along and goes back to some other mute point or talks trash about my cars, or something else.  So if I were to apologize for anything or to anyone, it will be for being not so considerate a host to Steph. ÂÂÂ




So if I dont reply to anything for awhile it means I am packing and living up my vacation.
my words exactally


thats so fugin true



HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR BRO!
talk to you in 05 and have a safe trip


i also wana add i think this as far as its gonna go im seeing things get repeted over and over and over again J there not worth it anymore  belive me   COURT IS AJOURNED !
And you were helping Jamie's case?


Maybe you should be his "mekanic" and use your ASE testing so we don't have these problems.
you sir can go jump off a cliff for all i care you are nothing to myself
you are worthless air
i was trying to put this just to rest,let it die
but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
you have to always get a stupid remark in

[cramez]

Quote (Jdawg4201 @ Dec. 28 2004,00:13)you sir can go jump off a cliff for all i care you are nothing to myself
you are worthless air
i was trying to put this just to rest,let it die
but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
you have to always get a stupid remark in , no wounder why people dont like you
YOUR AN @SS HOLE!
Dude, stop posting.  Seriously.  I understand fully that you are friends with Ribz and feel personally ticked off that he got stuck in a bad business deal.  But you are not helping him in any way.  You have done nothing but go straight to personal attacks.  Ribz was trying to put out his side of the story, and let it be known.  Your attacks are only ruining both your and his credibility.  Your posts are just turning what was a justifiable statement into a pointless flame-fest.

On a side note, I'm not on either side of anything on this one.  It just seems like a giant misunderstanding involving way too many people.  I've dealt with cack and steph several times, I get along fine with them, and have gotten many flawless parts from them for several of my cars (berettas and otherwise).  They are good people if they are treated the same.  I wouldn't want to be an enemy of either one though.