Just put in new fuel injectors

Have a flashing light? Gauges acting funny? Bad idle? Get your problems solved...
BoxLiveFresh
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Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:41 am

Finally making headway on my 1989 2.8 Corsica. viewtopic.php?f=8&t=24943 replaced all six injectors. No leaks from the fuel rail. The car Idles much better and doesn't die anymore. It still Idles rough though, and the SES light turns on (Code 12 only). I accidently broke off a part of the AC Vaccum conrol valve (bottom stem in attached picture.) Do you think this could be causing a big enough vaccum leak to throw off the idle? I can hear air hissing out of the check valve pretty good. I already ordered a new one from rock auto. Just have to wait a week for the three dollar part to know for sure.
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Cam2363
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby Cam2363 » Tue Oct 15, 2019 11:30 am

Even small Vaccum leaks can throw off idle. Try plugging the line to see if that causes any improvement.



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Thu Oct 17, 2019 11:51 am

Cam2363 wrote:Even small Vaccum leaks can throw off idle. Try plugging the line to see if that causes any improvement.


I did notice an improvement when placing my finger over the broken valve piece. It was hissing pretty loud. Yesterday I got the replacement part from rock auto. Put it on and plugged the hoses in, now the car doesn't want to start... I just about drained the battery trying to get it to start, at times it seemed like it was beginning to cycle. I swapped the hoses around on the three-way check valve I just replaced thinking I hooked it up wrong, no effect. So im hoping unplugging the battery to charge will help. Maybe the computer got used to running with a vaccum leak. I will try fresh gas as well. Under a 1/4 tank now with gas that is at least six months old.



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:08 pm

Oh and every day after I did the injectors about a week ago, I was running the car for 20 minutes or so, just to keep things flowing. But for the couple days before yesterday when I replaced the AC compressor control valve, I had not run the car.



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ifixalot
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby ifixalot » Fri Oct 18, 2019 9:28 am

I doubt that little piece would stop the engine from starting.
You probably disconnected something by accident or coincidentally,
the engine control module died. 6 month old gas should not be a problem
either.



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:48 pm

ifixalot wrote:I doubt that little piece would stop the engine from starting.
You probably disconnected something by accident or coincidentally,
the engine control module died. 6 month old gas should not be a problem
either.


Okay, I'm going to work on the car this weekend, I might pop the plenum off and retrace my steps as well... As far as the ECM goes, would that bring up a trouble code?



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ifixalot
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby ifixalot » Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:22 pm

Code 12 is the normal code, meaning your engine is not running. You must wait for a code to flash three times before it will move on to the next code.
If you only have code 12, there should be no light because of that. So you must have another code stored.
In diagnostic mode, it will flash once, then twice and it will do that three times. Then it will flash, lets say twice and then twice for 22 and it will do that three times. If there are other codes, they will follow. If no other codes, it will go back to one flash then two flashes for 12.
Did you have a code with the engine running? The ses light will light when you turn on the key just to show the bulb is OK.
If you had no light when running, you don't have a code stored. If the engine won't start, how are you getting a code?



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:06 pm

ifixalot wrote:Code 12 is the normal code, meaning your engine is not running. You must wait for a code to flash three times before it will move on to the next code.
If you only have code 12, there should be no light because of that. So you must have another code stored.
In diagnostic mode, it will flash once, then twice and it will do that three times. Then it will flash, lets say twice and then twice for 22 and it will do that three times. If there are other codes, they will follow. If no other codes, it will go back to one flash then two flashes for 12.
Did you have a code with the engine running? The ses light will light when you turn on the key just to show the bulb is OK.
If you had no light when running, you don't have a code stored. If the engine won't start, how are you getting a code?


It had a code 12 when it was running after I replaced the injectors, and discovered I had broken the AC vaccum control valve causing a vaccum leak. Only recently had a no start condition when I replaced that broken piece.



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Rettax3
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby Rettax3 » Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:24 pm

Ifixalot is spot-on, Code 12 means ECM is in diagnostic mode, meaning you are retrieving codes and whatnot -it isn't actually a "malfunction" Code at all. On an '89, that vacuum leak would cause the engine to idle-up a little, MAYBE stall during driving under certain conditions, and possibly run a tad 'off' as the computer tries to regain desired idle speed. But '89s ran Speed-Density fuel control, meaning that they used a MAP sensor, so the computer will add fuel for the air pressure in the manifold, whether that is coming from an open throttle-body or a vacuum-leak doesn't matter to that point (if the leak is actually in one of the intake runners, that could be a problem as only one cylinder would be effected, causing that one to run lean, but we are talking about a leak from a vacuum-port in the upper plenum here). Many '88s had a MAF (Mass Air Flow) that was eventually programmed-out by the dealerships, and our '96 V-6s use a MAF as well, any air getting into the manifold from any source OTHER THAN through the MAF will throw-off the fuel metering and cause problems. But '89s never had that problem...


1989 SuperCharged 3800 Srs-II (First)Six-Speed GTU
1990 Turbo 3.4 5-Speed T-Type
1990 4.0L 4-Cam 32-Valve V-8 5-Speed Indy GTi (Project)
1990 Stock(!) 3.1 MPFI Auto Indy
1995 LA1/L82 4T60E Z-26
1995 3.4 DOHC Turbo 5-Speed Z-26

BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:20 pm

Rettax3 wrote:Ifixalot is spot-on, Code 12 means ECM is in diagnostic mode, meaning you are retrieving codes and whatnot -it isn't actually a "malfunction" Code at all. On an '89, that vacuum leak would cause the engine to idle-up a little, MAYBE stall during driving under certain conditions, and possibly run a tad 'off' as the computer tries to regain desired idle speed. But '89s ran Speed-Density fuel control, meaning that they used a MAP sensor, so the computer will add fuel for the air pressure in the manifold, whether that is coming from an open throttle-body or a vacuum-leak doesn't matter to that point (if the leak is actually in one of the intake runners, that could be a problem as only one cylinder would be effected, causing that one to run lean, but we are talking about a leak from a vacuum-port in the upper plenum here). Many '88s had a MAF (Mass Air Flow) that was eventually programmed-out by the dealerships, and our '96 V-6s use a MAF as well, any air getting into the manifold from any source OTHER THAN through the MAF will throw-off the fuel metering and cause problems. But '89s never had that problem...


After replacing the fuel injectors after all six were reading very low voltage, that is basically what the car was doing. It ran fine enough to be driven, although throttle response was a little off. It just seemed like the car couldn't decide on an idle so it was going between high and low rpm. I assumed it was due to the small vaccum leak. The SES light came on and when I checked by grounding the obd1 plug and counted blinks it was only code 12 which I assumed meant no code.

But now after not running the car for a few days, and fixing the vaccum leak, I can't get it to start. I took off the plenum today and made sure everything looked good and plugged in. I did remember that the orange insulator pieces that go in the connectors for the fuel injectors were in pretty rough shape and some even fell apart. I didn't replace them but I don't think that would keep it from starting though.

My theory at this point the fuel regulator may have given up the ghost after running with new injectors and then sitting a few days. This car has been sitting for almost six years now. I'm going to bring home a fuel pressure gauge on monday and see what kind of numbers I get cranking it over.

My other theory is maybe the ICM decided to poop out all of a sudden, I replaced all the coil packs, wires and plugs already. Or perhaps it's the ECM like ifixalot was saying. Maybe all the electronics on this thing due to age and sitting are just failing as I try and resurrect this thing. I have been working on it here and there, running it every once and a while for well over a year now. The car is in great shape though, no corrosion or rust anywhere.



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:45 pm

Ok just got done testing fuel pressure.
Yeah something is up, only 5 psi with the key forward, only goes to 10 psi when attempting to start. Car beguns to cycle when using engine starter fluid into the intake. Its gotta be the FPR or fuel pump. What do you guys think? I should definitely change both the FPR and the fuel pump. But which one first? Project car with a limited budget for now.



Cam2363
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby Cam2363 » Thu Oct 24, 2019 10:48 am

BoxLiveFresh wrote:Ok just got done testing fuel pressure.
Yeah something is up, only 5 psi with the key forward, only goes to 10 psi when attempting to start. Car beguns to cycle when using engine starter fluid into the intake. Its gotta be the FPR or fuel pump. What do you guys think? I should definitely change both the FPR and the fuel pump. But which one first? Project car with a limited budget for now.


That pressure is pretty bad haha. What I would try first is to remove the vacuum line on the FPR. If fuel comes out from that port, replace the regulator, its bad.

Now, I don't know a ton, but a bad fuel pump probably wouldn't cause low pressure. A restriction, on the other hand, could cause bad pressure. You might have a restriction somewhere. My best advice is to try to test before the FPR. If your pressure is good, the FPR is probably the culprit. If the pressure is still low, then its a restriction in the lines or the pump is the issue.

Normally the testers have some sort of T fitting you can splice in. You could also try removing the line from the FPR and somehow attach the tester to that. I think they come with rubber tips but im not sure.

Also, make sure that all the connection points of your tester are sealed well, any leaks from there could show it having a pressure drop when there really isn't one.



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:40 pm

Alright guys after replacing the fuel pump and fuel pressure regulator the car is finally running and driving. Just working on a turn signal issue right now. Replacing the flasher here pretty soon. I was just wondering if anyone had a break down on how to take apart the steering column to get to the turn signal switch?



BoxLiveFresh
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Re: Just put in new fuel injectors

Postby BoxLiveFresh » Mon Oct 05, 2020 6:18 pm

Ok so I figured out. Dropped the column retaining bolts and now I just need a steering wheel puller and the turn signal switch I have to order online. By the way... I didn't unhook the dashboard gear selector cable and now its all wonky so if anybody has any quick tips on how to readjust that that would be awesome lol.




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