Beretta.net

Clutch stiff and doesnt disengage until right at the floor.

Yes the slave will creep when unhooked, that is normal.

I dont remember my 91 clutch pedal having more than one hole. What "second hole" are you talking about? Maybe yours is different. Mine releases about mid-pedal and it is very light.

If you have already replaced the master and slave without change it would lead me to suspect a possible issue with the fork or throw out bearing.

Clutch stiff and doesnt disengage until right at the floor.

gm synchromesh is the best, but if you don't want to spend all that money, I have been running 5w30 in mine without issue for years now.

If you don't want to spend the money buy Penzoil Syncromesh... I wouldn't use just 5w30 oil.

Clutch stiff and doesnt disengage until right at the floor.

The second type slave does not have a bleeder-valve on it, I actually dumped the original slave off of my '90 Turbo 'Retta to retro-fit with a type 1, from an '88 or '89 GT, IIRC. You will need to bench-bleed your new slave (actually an easier procedure than trying to do it in the car anyway, but...).

With the rod for the master located to a different point on the clutch-pedal arm, could you be over-extending the piston in the master-cylinder? Maybe that is why it worked at first, then got worse? Just a thought on that.

Did you have the time to check the movement of the fork and throw-out bearing before reinstalling the trans in the car? It sounds like it could be something binding up with the fork too. Hopefully it was just a hydraulic issue, and you'll have it fixed now though. Good luck.

5W30 motor-oil compared to 80W90 gear-oil is almost like running water in your tranny, but it is hard to argue with tested results, so... I certainly wouldn't do it in my tranny, but again, if it works for you, then it works.

Synchromesh is much lighter than gear oil. But I still would not run anything in a Muncie but Synchromesh.

woody90gtz wrote:Synchromesh is much lighter than gear oil. But I still would not run anything in a Muncie but Synchromesh.

There are different weights for gear oil, different weights for Synchromesh too, I believe. All of my books here (Chilton, Haynes, and the Owner's Manuals) agree with you, Synchromesh 12345349 or equivalent. I have been told for years that 80W90 is equivalent, in every aspect that the Muncie/Getrags would care about, but going the safe route is rarely a bad idea. Besides, with GL-5 Gear oil, you supposedly have to worry about the sulfur additives eating the bronze in some transmissions' synchronizers, I don't know how true that is though. Transmission fluid for manuals is weird science -the T-5s in all of my Camaros call for ATF , my '70 Mopar wants straight GL-5 gear oil, as did my old '80s GMC truck, IIRC the Isuzu transaxle in my '97 Z-24 called for 80W90 gear oil (or possibly the older Isuzu five-speed I retro-fitted in there to get rid of the concentric slave-cylinder did?), but the Berettas want Synchromesh because GL-5 is too corrosive...

Okay, yeah, like Woody says, Synchromesh is your best bet, if you can afford it.

Edit:
Okay, learn something new everyday... I have a current project that makes direct use of this info, so I'm glad I found it, I credit this thread with prompting my research into this direction. Anyone interested in why Synchromesh fluid should be used in their Beretta's manual transmission should read this: http://www.widman.biz/uploads/Transaxle_oil.pdf
Hopefully it pulls up from here -a good read if you are a die-hard gear-head. It focuses largely towards Corvairs, but the info is relevant to us too. And it mentions 5W30 as a transmission fluid too... Things that make you go, "Hmmm".

To add to the oddities my subaru will grind third if I use anything but Subaru Extra-S gear oil, including Mobil 1 full synthetic.

Clutch stiff and doesnt disengage until right at the floor.

Time to replace the master again I guess. That's weird.

GHOSTOWLGRID wrote:I went and found Pennzoil Synchromesh. It works good. However I only got to try it a couple times until the clutch hydraulics failed.
The oil seems a little thin to me, but I guess its correct, it says it meets and exceeds GM equivalent spec 12345349, and thats what the book says the car takes.
Well, when I bench bled the current type 1 hydraulics, and the engagement point was center, then with each press got closer and closer to the floor.
So that is why I'm thinking the hydraulics are bad, I just hope I'm right. lol
I will post results when I get the rest of my parts and get it all together.

I just ordered some Redline MT-series GL-4 synthetic fluid at $15/qt shipped -but this isn't for a 282 ... But I won't jack your thread further on that... I personally have a thing against Pennzoil, I would run store-brand before them, but I know some people absolutely swear by it, I've just seen too many engines sludge-up and get coated with varnish/tar from Pennzoil to trust anything they make, but I'm not putting down their Synchromesh as I have zero experience with it, and if Jon is referring to it, he must have had good results.

It does sound like you are sucking air into the system, if you got air out of it during a bench-bleed procedure. Either cylinder could cause that, or a bad line or reservoir supply-hose. I still wonder if the pedal-travel might have been causing the master cylinder's piston to over-travel and possibly damage itself or the slave though. It should be a safe assumption that the fluid-level is okay, right?

If you no longer have the issue with the pedal being very hard to move, then you might have cured that when you lubricated the throw-out bearings' guide shaft. Was that bone-dry when you disassembled it?

Clutch stiff and doesnt disengage until right at the floor.

GHOSTOWLGRID wrote:All I gotta fix after that is the missing problem and it will be good as new!

Gee, I was some more of my problems were missing too... Sorry! I couldn't pass that one up! I'm glad it is going back together well for you. Honestly, it sounds like you will have a better-than-stock setup when you are done. I would live to see some pics of the new line...