I can't even keep a floor simple.

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Rettax3
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I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby Rettax3 » Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:56 am

:roll: Yeah, it is just how I am, I guess. I like a challenge...

Although this isn't Beretta, or even car related, it is what has been keeping me from doing anything car related for a while now. I finally drove my 'old' '95 Z a bit the other day, and may get the Yellow Indy back out again tomorrow, but for the last month or two I've almost exclusively been riding either one of my bikes or our 3-wheel Spyder unless I needed to make a run for materials with the van.

IMAG0260.jpg
Nasty old carpet out -who puts carpet in a dining room anyway?

IMAG0264.jpg
Second layer of 3/4 subfloor paneling -adds strength, rigidity, and a place for a 5/8-inch deep channel...

IMAG0278.jpg
Ready for beam-up! It looks like a space-ship in here... Or the insides of a giant refrigerator, but either way...

IMAG0280.jpg
But this looks much nicer! Feels great just to walk on it too.


This was the first room I did, I'm just going room-to-room redoing as I go. The living-room has three separate loops (pretty big room, but I could have gotten away with just two) and is 2/3 done now with the sub-surface stuff. It is taking a lot longer than I had hoped, but it will all be worth it in the end, I think. I've been learning the fine art of making more spare time in the day, so I could use it on this. So far, I am up to about 25.7 hours in each day, :crazy: but I've got to get better at it so I can get this thing done.


1989 SuperCharged 3800 Srs-II (First)Six-Speed GTU
1990 Turbo 3.4 5-Speed T-Type
1990 4.0L 4-Cam 32-Valve V-8 5-Speed Indy GTi (Project)
1990 Stock(!) 3.1 MPFI Auto Indy
1995 LA1/L82 4T60E Z-26
1995 3.4 DOHC Turbo 5-Speed Z-26

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ifixalot
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby ifixalot » Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:59 am

Looks like you did a great job on the floor. I personally don't get heated floors. Maybe for floors on a slab.
Does it heat the room or just keep your feet warm?
Pardon my ignorance but then I have carpet in my dining room. haha
But seriously folks, I know I have a lot of updating to do in my home.



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Rettax3
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby Rettax3 » Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:14 pm

ifixalot wrote:Looks like you did a great job on the floor. I personally don't get heated floors. Maybe for floors on a slab.
Does it heat the room or just keep your feet warm?
Pardon my ignorance but then I have carpet in my dining room. haha
But seriously folks, I know I have a lot of updating to do in my home.

Thank you, it is a lot of work, but is coming out well. I enjoy projects like this, knowing I did the work myself. Of course, I take that too far... :roll:
The electrically-heated pads that get used in front of bathroom vanities and such only keep your feet warm, and are a comfort item that cost a lot both to install and to operate. I don't really get those either -put some socks on for crying out loud!

But, a full hydronic system (hot water or other fluid) like this actually IS the primary heat-source for the room (or whole house). They are considered one of the most efficient heating sources currently available, and the technology has come a LONG way recently, making them even better. I am installing a 7-loop system, so each loop (or 'zone') can be individually adjusted for need. One catch on hydronic systems is that you can't just flip a switch and turn it on and off -especially with hardwood floors you can do some damage to them that way, but since this will be heating 90% of the house, I don't want it getting super cold at any time anyway. Each loop can be controlled thermostatically with electrically-operated supply and mixing valves, I'm not sure I am going that route. Right now, I am setting-up for a mechanical system, the distribution manifold I have is adjustable for both pressure and flow-rate, so I can fine-tune it for need with a heat sensor. I am in a pretty temperate climate now, so the system won't be over-worked at all, and can use a low temperature fluid-supply that won't be able to hurt the floor even if I 'forget' to monitor the system for minor changes. If it is too much effort, I can easily retrofit the electronic 'zone' controls.


1989 SuperCharged 3800 Srs-II (First)Six-Speed GTU
1990 Turbo 3.4 5-Speed T-Type
1990 4.0L 4-Cam 32-Valve V-8 5-Speed Indy GTi (Project)
1990 Stock(!) 3.1 MPFI Auto Indy
1995 LA1/L82 4T60E Z-26
1995 3.4 DOHC Turbo 5-Speed Z-26

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3X00-Modified
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby 3X00-Modified » Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:00 am

I need to update the radiant floor system that is in my (current 3 season room) to control it better... It's a three level concrete floor room with 3 separate loops that all tie into one circulator... It was installed in 1972 when that addition of the house was built. It needs the 3 slabs isolated as well as the slab temp monitored so it can maintain that temp and not allow the slab to cool off to much, that slams the furnace when it would start up to maintain room temp... Went through way too much oil last year trying to keep that room warm till after Christmas Eve... That wont happen this year, lines are all emptied for now.

Of course, all of that will happen AFTER I replace the 3 huge sliding doors that are far from efficient insulators since they are also from 1972... Once that's done, then I can think about properly controlling the temp in that room, perhaps all year round too.



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woody90gtz
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby woody90gtz » Thu Aug 08, 2019 2:51 pm

Radiant heat is really nice. Even and comfortable.

I just got done with finishing the whole basement in my house. I used to like doing that stuff...but I'm over it. Haha


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91 "SS" - WOT 3400/5spd - 13.29@101.6 - World's fastest N/A FWD Beretta
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Rettax3
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby Rettax3 » Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:44 am

woody90gtz wrote:Radiant heat is really nice. Even and comfortable.

I just got done with finishing the whole basement in my house. I used to like doing that stuff...but I'm over it. Haha

I hear ya. I STILL like doing this stuff, BUT, my back, knees, etc. do NOT. And I keep not looking out the window at the GTA waiting for the turbo 3800 5-speed swap, the 'Vert IROC waiting for me to build the 'Vette/Vortec/TPI hybrid engine 5-speed swap (I did get the pedal assembly swapped and clutch hydraulics installed the other day though -I now have three cars with automatic shifters and three pedals :D ) and heated glass rear window upgrade, the Toyotas looking for suspension or wheel-bearing work, the list just goes on and on. "We are the architects of our own suffering." At least I enjoy the thought of doing the work waiting for me! :wink:

Work called the other day too, and it feels good to be needed, but there are now three customers confirmed waiting for me to become available, and two more that would like me to spend some time on their cars. It is good to be able to set my own time for things like this, but I also know that if left ignored for too long, the well dries up.

Hopefully this weekend I'll get into the kitchen floor (the loop supply and return pipes for it need to be run along one side of the living-room, so I cannot complete that part of the living-room until the kitchen is at least done with pipe). I finished the top layer of sub-flooring in the living-room today though, and just have about 200 feet of routing to complete for the water-pipe, and it won't take very long to drop in the pipe after that. I doubt I'll have that loop finished tomorrow though -I'm just not moving the project that fast.


1989 SuperCharged 3800 Srs-II (First)Six-Speed GTU
1990 Turbo 3.4 5-Speed T-Type
1990 4.0L 4-Cam 32-Valve V-8 5-Speed Indy GTi (Project)
1990 Stock(!) 3.1 MPFI Auto Indy
1995 LA1/L82 4T60E Z-26
1995 3.4 DOHC Turbo 5-Speed Z-26

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Rettax3
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby Rettax3 » Wed Oct 16, 2019 12:46 pm

Well, most of this project is done -I had to step away from it here and there as life continued outside of my project. I am currently operating five of the seven available loops (I haven't done either bathroom yet -I am not trying for complete remodel there, but each one does need to be stripped-down, any water-damaged subfloor replaced, then everything built back up, Hardibacker panels installed over the routed second sub-floor layer and our chosen porcelain large-format tiles installed. I am taking a complete break from it for a week or two while I catch up on other things. The short-plank solid bamboo we chose for the living-room fought like hell going in -would have been fine as a glue-down, but nailing was tough because the planks are relatively thin for a solid construction and the bamboo material is so incredibly hard and unyielding -the tongue-part would get swelled-out by the force of the nail driven through, and would bottom-out in the groove part before the edge-gap was properly seated. Not every time, but frequently enough to cause serious delays -I recut CASES of the stuff on my table-saw to deepen the groove and even knock a little off the bottom edge for the planks that also swelled-out UNDER the tongue. I had a lot of hand-nailing along the edges too where the pneumatic nailer couldn't reach, and every last one of those had to be pre-drilled -quality bamboo flooring is too hard and the nail will literally bend 95% of the time rather than go through. PITA, I wish I had just used the same stuff as the dining room, but it is basically done now, except for the back hallway.
LvrFlr1b.jpg
Living-Room flooring, zig-zag pattern, looks good and even matches the fabric of the couch, but hard to work with and didn't come out as good as I had hoped.
Eventually, I will come back around to our pantry floors too (we have two of them), but as they weren't getting any heating loops, they are able to wait and should be separate sections anyway, and they are getting the same flooring as the kitchen, which was much easier to work with.
KitFlr1a.jpg
Beautiful material -easy to work with too, great for where we put it but would have been a bit much if we used it throughout the whole house IMO.


As for the heating, I've actually had to turn everything down a couple of times, it was getting too warm in the house. I bought a high-efficiency three-speed circulation pump, and everything is being regulated mechanically at the manifold valves -no electronics needed. It hasn't gotten really cold here yet, but we still have our fireplace if we need to boost it up a little, and I've got safely at least 20% higher supply temp I can go on the heater, and watching the cycling, the heater isn't being stressed at all. So far we haven't wanted to go even near the fireplace after turning the floor on. I got a great deal on a Watts accumulator, and found a good company that sells brass plumbing fittings for a good price, so virtually the whole system is made of aluminum-layered PEX tubing and brass fittings, no actual 'pipes' anywhere in the system, and as few fittings and joints as I could manage to minimize leak potentials.


1989 SuperCharged 3800 Srs-II (First)Six-Speed GTU
1990 Turbo 3.4 5-Speed T-Type
1990 4.0L 4-Cam 32-Valve V-8 5-Speed Indy GTi (Project)
1990 Stock(!) 3.1 MPFI Auto Indy
1995 LA1/L82 4T60E Z-26
1995 3.4 DOHC Turbo 5-Speed Z-26

aurolio
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby aurolio » Mon Oct 28, 2019 11:26 pm

The flooring looks great. Nice job!



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Rettax3
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby Rettax3 » Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:17 pm

Just a quick update to this for anyone who may be curious. After comparing our electric bills for the past few months to those from last year, our heated floor is costing us about $200 per month to operate in the colder months, but is SAVING us nearly $100 per month in propane heating costs. Our house is overall a little warmer feeling (it is actually quite cool, but doesn't feel that way at all due to the more efficient heat transfer), and when we visit other houses without heated floors, we find we are spoiled rotten -everything else just feels uncomfortable and cold, no matter how warm their house is.
Here are a few shots from when I did the first bathroom floor back in November...
BT1Floor3a.jpg
I used Red Gard -this is a water PROOF membrane. 100% protection from water damage, and fantastic adhesion for thinset mortar. You can see where the heating pipes are, helping to dry the Red Gard.

BT1Floor5a.jpg
We decided to have some fun with the vanity, and did a crackle-finish on it. We will be doing a conventional two-tone stain in the other bathroom. We also intend on epoxy-coating the counter-tops to change the coloration and freshen them up. SOMWHERE I have a few slabs of green marble and blue granite that might work well here, but I think the epoxy color-coating will be better. I still have to trim-in the baseboard tiles here.

I can't say I am crazy about the operational cost, but the effect is worth it.


1989 SuperCharged 3800 Srs-II (First)Six-Speed GTU
1990 Turbo 3.4 5-Speed T-Type
1990 4.0L 4-Cam 32-Valve V-8 5-Speed Indy GTi (Project)
1990 Stock(!) 3.1 MPFI Auto Indy
1995 LA1/L82 4T60E Z-26
1995 3.4 DOHC Turbo 5-Speed Z-26

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woody90gtz
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Re: I can't even keep a floor simple.

Postby woody90gtz » Sun Feb 02, 2020 4:37 pm

Yeah, that's pricey. But comfort isn't typically be cheap.

I finished my whole basement as living space this summer, and since the baby it's the least amount of time I've spent down there...ever. haha


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91 "SS" - WOT 3400/5spd - 13.29@101.6 - World's fastest N/A FWD Beretta
GEARHEAD youtube channel


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