Need Help ASAP!

RedRetta · Post by **RedRetta** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 8:12 pm

Okay this is beginning to piss me off.

The car is a 93 GT 3.1 with an auto tranny. Heres whats going on.

When we picked the car up, it took for EVER to get it started. We fuigered it was bad fuel. So, after carnking the living hell out of it, it finally started. Idle was a little wierd, but nothing horrible. Took it out for a drive. Noticed that when i held the accelerator steady, it would miss like crazy. I fuigered it was bad gas along with needing a tune up. So we drove it home, and ran it over the next 2 weeks to get the gas out of it. I let it get almost empty, and i put a fresh tank of gas in it along with some fuel injector cleaner.

Didnt help a bit. So we did plugs, wires and after that, it seemed to run a *tiny* bit better. So, I fuigered after reading some of the posts about missing and idle problems, that i would clean out the EGR and the IAC. Seems simple to me, not too difficult. So after i clean out both of those components, I re-assembaled everything and start it up. It doesnt want to stay running at all. It will idle, but it seems like it is missing HORRIBLE, and then it will die. so today I took the entire throttle body apart, cleaned everything AGAIN, and guess what?

It started kind of hard the first time i turned the key, and i let it idle. It started missing and about 45 seconds later, it dies. Cant re-start it at all. it turns over, but wont catch. I can hear the fuel pump working, so I know thats not it.

Also, when driving before, it would be missing at highway speeds, the SES light would come on, and it wouldnt miss any more. it would drive smooth while the SES was on, and then it would go off, and start to miss again. *** am I missing here???

Oh yeah, I disconnected the TCC and no change at all. so i put it back on. G'Dmn car is going to be blown up here soon.

Jeff P · Post by **Jeff P** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:20 am

The first thing I'd check for is spark at the plugs. Remove the plugs one at a time and with the plug wires attached, hold the tip of the plug close to the engine while someone cranks the engine.

An injector problem is also possible, so you'll probably want to check the resistance of each of them (should be about 12 ohms). While you've got the plenum off and all the plugs disconnected from the injectors, connect a test light to 12V and while someone cranks the engine, touch the tip of the test light to each of the pins in the injector harness. If the light blinks, the computer is controlling the injectors okay and the wiring is probably in good condition. Make sure the coolant lines are still connected to the throttlebody, the fuel lines are still connected to the fuel rail, and the fuel rail is still connected to the injectors or you may have a bit of a mess....and maybe a fire

Maybe someone else has some simpler suggestions?

RedRetta · Post by **RedRetta** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 7:33 pm

Pulled codes, After I got it running today, but it ran like shiit. It missed through the spped range, except when i mashed the pedal down. It didnt want to kick down when i stopped, and then when it did, it would sound like a diesle.

I got the following:

Code 33
Code 35
Code 44

Any clues?? Please??

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 8:14 pm

code 33---map sensor signal voltage high , low vacuum chiltons
+ ALSO-maf sensor or circuit (excessive airflow indicated).-Hynes manual

code 35----idle speed control circuit

code 44-------oxygen sensor-lean exhaust indicated

RedRetta · Post by **RedRetta** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 2:15 pm

Okay, i looked up the codes, so I know what they mean. Could a bad iac cause those other codes to pop up? I know the O2 sensor is probly shot, because of that code and the fact its running pig rich. So, I do beleive that the o2 sensor is shot. The IAC was switched from the other beretta we have, and now it actually does start up just fine. However, its still pig rich, and it doesnt want to STAY running. I tried to do the Idle re-learn, but after the first cycle, it started running rough, and then it died. It would turn over and catch, but then it wouldnt idle. Just quit. Any suggestions? Ive cleaned out the entire plenum, and that started most of the problems. So....... what next?

Jeff P · Post by **Jeff P** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 11:04 am

If the car sounds like a diesel you've probably got an exhaust leak. I've seen the whole top of an oxygen sensor come off leaving an open hole in the exhaust. Also check for a vacuum leak, plugged PCV valve, and fuel in the fuel pressure regulator line.

payback · Post by **payback** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 1:40 pm

try starting off as simple as possible, the first thing i do anytime i start having problems is remove the fuse panel and replace everything with new.
then if i were you i would disconnect the negative terminal and do the idle relearn again, only by disconnecting the negative terminal will you clear any codes and computer before replacing ANY sensors, you dont want to chase your tail if you fix the problem the computer wont recognize it because the codes are still there.

RedRetta · Post by **RedRetta** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:03 pm

Alright, I'll Try the idle re-learn again. The o2 sensor is still there. not loose or anything. i know i have a leak near the cat, where i put an adapter piece in there to re-connect it. No biggie, because I smashed the cat out. tailpipe is clear, and has a brand new muffler on it. I have 3 more plugs/wires to change, wicjh are the back three. i dont think they are the problem though, considering that it ran (albiet with a miss) before i cleaned the IAC and the EGR. everything is hooked back up correctly. The code 33 could be because i had the air filter top off at the time of the drive, throwing that code. The o2 is probly shot, because its reporting a lean condition, when the car is obviously running pig rich. That may have been the cause of the miss to begin with? Too much fuel + old spark plugs ( Fouled black with soot) = spark drowning out in fuel = miss? And then stupid me, I pulled the plunger out of the old IAC when I was cleaning it. I swapped it into the other beretta, and it ran like shiite, but not quite as bad as the GT. Swapped the one from the base in to the GT, and it ran a lot better. SO.... I think this is a combo problem between the o2 and the IAC. Sound right?

Mr Goodwrench · Post by **Mr Goodwrench** » Tue May 02, 2006 10:54 pm

I would replace the IAC an O2 with a NEW ones!! using parts from a nother car with out knowing if running correctly is just a waste of time!!! yes it may get you in the ball park but never a home run unless u are very lucky..
just because the SES LIGHT isnt on doesnt mean it running correctly!!!!!!!

you would need a scanner with data display to see if the part is working correctly..checking air/fuel ratio, o2 counts and so on.

could have a injector sticking open causin the rich problem fouling out the plugs.. if you had the intake off an injectors out could u of installed one of the wires on the wrong injector?? just a thought or a leaking intake gasket??

Mr Goodwrench

RedRetta · Post by **RedRetta** » Wed May 03, 2006 9:40 am

Nope, the IAC I used came off a perfectly running beretta. The only reason we dont drive that one is because its falling apart, body wise. Ask boner, he saw it. LOL It actually turned out to be a combination of the IAC ( origional one was stuck but good) and the O2 sensor ( insulator was cracked, and leaking air like a mother!) Now it idles and drives perfect! All I need to do now is body work, and it will be good to go! thaks for the replies all!

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